Freeview changes: 29th/30th June as COM7 closes

[Aplus1]

Completetly disagree - most people do little more with their phone or PC than they did the last time they updated it, but the updates enables it to do more should you desire to benefit from it.   TV should be the same, and even then we're talking updates every decade or two rather than every 3-5 years.    The cost of updating is also less than updating other technology.

Then you update your technology, and enjoy. Nobody is stopping you. 

For most people, the TV is something to have in the corner of the room, making some noises and pictures now and again. It's not the "lean-forward" super laser powered interactive virtual ultra high definition Dolby Atmos experience that some people seem to think should be the standard, and anything less is just simply unviewable. 

If you want that, have it and enjoy it. For most other people, it's only television, and like a washing machine they change theirs only when the old one breaks. Most people feel no need to buy a new TV set every year to keep up with whatever is the current fashion.

[Brekkie]

That's like saying your phone is only for calls or your PC only for emails and word processing. You don't develop a platform based on those who get minimal use out of it - otherwise why did they even bother adding ITV in 1955?

Anyway, we're going round in circles.

[Aplus1]

That's like saying your phone is only for calls or your PC only for emails and word processing.  You don't develop a platform based on those who get minimal use out of it - otherwise why did they even bother adding ITV in 1955?

Anyway, we're going round in circles.

There's a big difference between 

"we want to add a new thing, which you can get now, or at any time in the future when you buy new equipment"

and 

"we're turning off the old thing so that we can do the same old thing in a brand new way, so you'll have to buy new equipment or lose everything."

The first option is "a new thing for you, if and when you want it". The second option is "you have to buy again to keep what you used to have". And for most people it will indeed be "to keep what you used to have" because there won't be thousands of new HD channels available if everyone goes DVB-T2 overnight, it'll just be the same SD channels transmitted in a slightly different way which will be of no discernable benefit to most people.

But we clearly disagree - so let's at least agree to disagree.

[Markymark]

Between 2023 and 2024 the mobile phone networks will be ceasing support for 3G.  Hypothetically would it be possible for OFCOM to borrow part of this range for a temporary MUX? 

The spectrum freed up by closing down 3G will be immediately ploughed back into 4G/5G, that's the primary reason for getting rid of it (3G is unique in that it "hogs" a lot of valuable spectrum even when there are few users. This doesn't apply to 2G, so that's why there are no plans to close this down)

Also, 3G was never deployed in "TV" spectrum, so there's nothing there that would be usable anyway

2G will outlast 3G also because it's embedded in a great deal of devices for telemetry, such as smart meters,  traffic lights, security alarms,  etc

And of course with a nod towards what @Aplus1 has been saying, quite a lot of 'dumb phones'. In fact not so long ago didn't such phones still account for 40% or so O2's business?

[mici01]

2G will outlast 3G also because it's embedded in a great deal of devices for telemetry, such as smart meters,  traffic lights, security alarms,  etc

And of course with a nod towards what @Aplus1 has been saying, quite a lot of 'dumb phones'. In fact not so long ago didn't such phones still account  for 40% or so O2's business?

Also you can do dynamic spectrum sharing DSS with 2G, but not with 3G.

[AndrewP]

That's worrying if they're shutting down 3G.. I'm in London Zone 4 and sometimes can barely get 3G whilst outside... Vodafone better do something about that

[Markymark]

That's worrying if they're shutting down 3G.. I'm in London Zone 4 and sometimes can barely get 3G whilst outside... Vodafone better do something about that

And presumably no 4G either (which is more of a worry) ?

What about the other networks?

[Neil Jones]

https://www.computerweekly.com/news/2525...years-time - Three UK has announced that the UK’s first 3G network will be switched off at the end of 2024.

In December 2021, the UK government and the leading UK mobile network operators (MNOs) – Vodafone, EE, Virgin Media O2 and Three – agreed on 2033 as the date by which all public 2G and 3G networks in the UK will be switched off.

[Brekkie]

They should have called themselves G instead.

[Worzel]

Honestly appalling that BBC News HD is being eliminated on Freeview. I understand that it is still available in HD via iPlayer but it certainly deserves terrestrial coverage in HD.

Doesn't directly solve the problem, but currently you can press green to watch the (current) live programme stream of the BBC News channel from the start on connected TVs in HD. A workaround would be if you could press green and it would take you/connected TVs straight to the live stream on iPlayer. It would save us faffing through 4 menu screens to get there on the connected app. You can fast forward the stream so it catches up with real-time but its a pain if you're say, 45 minutes into the hour.

[XIII]

Are Three turning off their 2G network at the same time?

I am surprised 2033 is the date, 11 years seems a lengthy time to keep these 2G and 3G networks especially since we might have 6G by the end of the decade.

[Brekkie]

Honestly appalling that BBC News HD is being eliminated on Freeview. I understand that it is still available in HD via iPlayer but it certainly deserves terrestrial coverage in HD.

Doesn't directly solve the problem, but currently you can press green to watch the (current) live programme stream of the BBC News channel from the start on connected TVs in HD. A workaround would be if you could press green and it would take you/connected TVs straight to the live stream on iPlayer. It would save us faffing through 4 menu screens to get there on the connected app. You can fast forward the stream so it catches up with real-time but its a pain if you're say, 45 minutes into the hour.

Easily solved by just adding the option you get when tuning in directly via the iPlayer of watching live or from the start.

Can't see the restart option being used much on the news channel anyway given the cyclical nature of the content.

[i.h]

Are Three turning off their 2G network at the same time?

I am surprised 2033 is the date, 11 years seems a lengthy time to keep these 2G and 3G networks especially since we might have 6G by the end of the decade.

They don't have a 2G network (clue is in the name, a reference to being 3G only when they launched), they contracted with O2 and later Orange (as it then was) to provide 2G coverage where they didn't yet have 3G. I think that was removed a long time ago. By now they have 800MHz 4G for rural coverage (they call this "supervoice"), better than the 3G coverage ever was, which should allow them to get rid of 3G quite easily

3G is going within the next year or two. 2G, as already said, isn't all that onerous to keep around (and some networks like EE replaced all the 2G kit as part of the 4G upgrade, so it's not like they're actually keeping obsolete equipment running)

[Markymark]

They should have called themselves G instead.

Vodafone have expressed a recent interest in buying Three,  so I suspect if that happens they will just get absorbed in, or perhaps Three's customer base will get aligned with Voxi?

[Newshound47]

One challenge would be need some very good communication to explain to people what tv’s would still work without doing anything and what ones wouldn’t anymore and would need an additional box.